David Morrow (00:31.75)
So Liam, how you doing buddy? And what brings you to the show today?

Liam DeBoer (01:26.136)
Fantastic, man. No, I’m looking forward to chatting. Yeah, we crossed paths there about a week or two ago online and I just like what you’re putting down and putting out there as well. I thought it’d be good to hop on and have a conversation between the two of us.

David Morrow (01:42.704)
Liam, I gotta get this out of the way first. This is a health and fitness podcast, but I have a feeling this is gonna be very heavy on the politics. So I read somewhere on the internet that you did a four by four by 48 challenge. Is that true?

Liam DeBoer (01:56.878)
Yes, yeah, yeah. So right before COVID and for the first year into COVID, I was extremely heavy into endurance training and endurance events. I’ve got a handful of marathons under my belt. Did four by four by 48. Did, I think my most proud achievement in that space is I did 27 half marathons in 28 days.

David Morrow (02:23.216)
Whoa!

Liam DeBoer (02:23.278)
And most of those were for fundraisers. So I enjoyed doing them for for instance, the four by four by 48 was for a friend that had a construction company going into COVID and he actually mainly did like corporate builds at airports for advertisements and stuff. So if you, you know, walking through the airport and you see a big Johnny Walker booth kind of thing, he was, he was the one actually building

David Morrow (02:48.742)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (02:52.738)
booths and as soon as all of those things got shut down all of a the ad dollars that companies were spending didn’t go there and then he actually had an accident on top of that where a piece from a nail gun exploded and took out one of his eyes and so he was he was like he was he was in a really rough spot so I said all right

let’s try to do a little fundraiser. And that was what the 4x4x48 was. I said I’d do this for two days, tried to drum up some noise on social media about it. And then we raised a decent little chunk of cash for him that kept his rent afloat for a couple of months. And then I gave him some time to recover.

David Morrow (03:35.366)
Oh, that’s awesome, man. And for you folks that are listening, like, what the hell is a 4x4x48? Could you explain it to the listeners?

Liam DeBoer (03:43.532)
Yeah, so it’s four miles of running every four hours for 48 hours. So it essentially works out to be just shy of two marathons in two days. Surprisingly, actually, honestly, the physical aspect wasn’t that tough. Like if you could go do a four mile run by the time the next four hours is up, like you’re more or less recovered. Like my joints felt fine. It was just those like

waking up at 2 a.m. in the morning to go for a run or only having say two hours, three hours of sleep window for two days straight. That was the real challenge. So that was a fun one because it was more, well, lot of the marathons and stuff by then your body’s just breaking down. But this one, was the complete opposite. Body felt fine. Mind was the one that was struggling.

David Morrow (04:32.506)
Hmm. Now I think that’s a Goggins invention. If I’m not correct.

Liam DeBoer (04:37.294)
I think so, yeah. That’s who I first heard it through. And I’m not one of those guys that like, I don’t want to say be a marathon runner and then just spend my entire life trying to dial in my marathon time or shave two minutes off of the last marathon I did. That’s not quite my thing. So I just like doing different challenges from one to one. And I came across the David Goggins one and I thought that sounds like an interesting one. So yeah, I gave it a go.

David Morrow (05:06.798)
Right on. Having done it myself was hoping to with a friend. It fell through. I’ve been known to do triathlons and Ironmans and marathons and stuff like that myself. I’ve been focusing this year on, I like doing something that’s outside my wheelhouse every year. So this year it’s competing in jujitsu. I’m a white belt. And it’s scared the shit out of me already. Like I just started training. I have till April to like…

Liam DeBoer (05:17.751)
Nice.

Liam DeBoer (05:32.194)
Haha.

David Morrow (05:34.63)
cut weight and be ready. I’ve never cut weight for anything in terms of like fights. I’ve never fought in my life like competitively. So it’s also because my son is getting a little bit older. He’s eight and I’m worried that he, cause he goes to the Jiu-Jitsu gym all the time. I think he’s going to be able to like do some serious damage in like two to three years. And I, I just can’t let that happen psychologically. That’s, that’s a, that’s a non-starter for me. So I have to keep my skills sharp. No, like

Liam DeBoer (05:55.278)
you

Can’t let your 12 year old kid beat you up.

David Morrow (06:01.988)
Talk about like shattering the poor kid’s world too. Imagine he like heel hooks me and then like chokes me out. that’s, no, mean, knowing that you can beat up your dad at 12 is probably not a good thing. So I gotta keep my, I gotta keep my skills sharp. But yeah, I used to do a lot of the endure.

Liam DeBoer (06:14.51)
Good on you, good on you. know about three friends, I was gonna say, I have about three friends that that is their entire fitness mentality now is like Mike, or like I’ve got a good buddy that’s deep into football and he’s like, my kid is not going to be able to cover me. That will be way too big of an ego hit if my kid can cover me.

David Morrow (06:21.99)
hahahaha

David Morrow (06:28.262)
It is. It is. I get it. I get it. The one good thing about endurance sports, and then I’ve noticed on the mats is it gives me a bigger, fuel tank during like a five minute round where, you know, a 40, another 45 year old dad is just gassed out after about two and a half minutes. I still got some gas in the tank. So if I haven’t, if I’ve managed to survive the first two and a half minutes and not get choked to death, I’m usually going to do pretty well. So that’s my, that’s my strategy. Just, yeah.

I’ve come up with that over the last few months. Just don’t die, and then can take over two and a half minutes in. So I want to segue into the post that really struck my attention on Instagram. when I say you guys, you’ve got your own posts, Liam DeBoer, but you’ve also got Blender News, which is with your buddy. I mean, you’re doing a wide coverage here, and I love it.

in terms of topics and your content’s really engaging, but it was the one that related to COVID and what we’re gonna do next. So I’m gonna paraphrase here for folks to give them a bit of an idea of what we’re talking about, but it’s about holding people accountable and it hit hard. You were talking about how COVID created kind of like the disintegration of the fabric that holds everything together and pretending that the last four years didn’t exist.

Is not an option and to paraphrase like indifference hopelessness These are the real dangers and we can’t let this slip into oblivion We must hold the guilty accountable or we’re all complicit in the victory of tyranny I was like, man like talk about hit me in the chest Explain a little bit more about that video and the broader context to what we’re talking about here. We’re starting right into it, man We’re getting into the the meat of the conversation

Liam DeBoer (08:21.719)
Hahaha.

Well, yeah, that was definitely the topic that I one of the main topics that got me into this space. And, you know, you hear people constantly talk about it. So, for instance, there was intellectuals that I was big fans of, and I still listen to them here and there for sure. But say a guy like Sam Harris throughout covid, know, Sam Harris is a neuroscientist and also bridges into the realm of philosophy a lot as well. But he

throughout the pandemic kind of took the institutional establishment approach, which is that, you know, people need to trust their institutions and therefore his whole kind of view on it was that that’s a society that doesn’t trust its institutions will fall apart. And therefore we need to trust them, trust the science, blah, blah, blah, and go on and on and on. But there was another aspect of that that I felt like a lot of those people were missing, which is that on the other end of trust,

there’s a duty by the people that are supposed to be trusted to not abuse that trust. And so I think I completely agree with a lot of say the establishment figures that trust in social institutions is really important for social cohesion. But now we’ve gotten to this point where our society no longer trusts our institutions. I don’t meet anybody even say past liberals that trusts the liberal government. don’t trust, don’t.

come across anybody that’s like, I’m a massive CBC fan, other than say a few corners on Twitter or whatever, but the average public, that’s not the case anymore. And so I do see that as a massive problem. If we don’t have information centers that we can trust, if we don’t have government that we can trust and so on, health sectors and down the line, well, then of

Liam DeBoer (10:16.942)
everything is going to start fracturing and start that social fabric that I was mentioning, that just starts to disintegrate. And so now I look at it and go, well, okay, if we need that trust there, which I agree, well, where I differ from say the establishment types is that, well, we just need to grant them that trust and go forward. It’s like, no, you need accountability there. You need people to say, okay, well, when that trust is broken,

something is going to happen. There is going to be ramifications. I’m sorry, I’m not just gonna take your word for it again that you’re not gonna do the same thing you’ve already done. It’s like being in an abusive relationship with somebody. If somebody is, whatever, whether it’s checking your phone and surveilling you essentially in your relationship or whether it’s physical abuse or anything of that nature.

David Morrow (10:58.426)
Hmm.

Liam DeBoer (11:10.528)
If somebody doesn’t even acknowledge the fact that they did that, which our institutions have yet to do, how can I trust that your behavior is gonna change if you don’t even own up to the behavior that was done? So that’s the big problem I see is that, you know, until there’s accountability on that, you’re not gonna get that general population trust back.

David Morrow (11:33.389)
That is really, that’s a really important concept that I think, especially here in Canada, and maybe you can comment on this. Do you think that because we’re Canadian, because Canadians have been fed this notion that we’re nice, that we’re do-gooders, that this pandemic, that this…

hit us particularly hard because it’s more of a crisis of conscience than anything else. Is there anything there that you think made it worse for us and is making it worse for us long term?

Liam DeBoer (12:07.906)
Yeah, well, the big difference with Canada is that we are like, whether people, people don’t admit it, but it’s like, we are a socialist country. We have socialized healthcare. I mean, our government is involved in everything. There was a great, think it was, no, yeah, McDonald Laurier that did a study on it and found that the government is responsible. Once you factor in regulations and all of this, the government is responsible for roughly 60 % of our GDP. Like we’re,

David Morrow (12:36.294)
Whoa.

Liam DeBoer (12:37.602)
We’re way over the line into socialist. And even if you take out the regulatory powers that they have and just look at just spending, it’s 44%. Like right now our government expenditure is almost 50 % of our GDP. Like that’s insane. whether people, you know, I’m not saying that we’re a socialist country in the exact same way that say the Soviet Union was socialist, but.

David Morrow (12:39.802)
God, why?

Liam DeBoer (13:04.226)
we do have this very social idea within our mind. The universal healthcare especially is something that is ingrained in the psyche. And now I’m not even making an argument as to whether that should be a thing or not, just stating that yes, the social idea of a large government is kind of ingrained in the Canadian psyche, which is very different from America. America was born as a nation which was

rebelling against authority. So in the very basis of that idea of what it means to be American, is kind of like part of being American is being a rebel. That’s not a thing within the Canadian identity. And so I do think, you know, not necessarily just the like that plays a part in it, the whole the trope of us being nice and such, but also just this idea that

David Morrow (13:45.062)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (14:00.77)
the government is an integral part of who we are as Canada, that is a very deep part of our psyche. And so that’s where I think a lot of people, where we did shoot ourselves in the foot a little bit, is that we give a little bit too much trust to that institution without thinking about it.

David Morrow (14:20.452)
Hmm. Yeah, I have to agree on that. And so in the long term, if we’re looking for accountability, do you think that’s going to bite us too? Because we’ll just say, well, you know what, it’s fine. You know, they they stomped all over us. They prevented us from seeing our dying relatives and having birthdays. And you know what, what’s done is done. I mean, my opinion is that I don’t

I don’t think as a country we’re going to be able to move forward unless we actually have the accountability. I don’t know what the accountability looks like, but I know you mentioned in one of your videos, right, Nuremberg-like trials. But we all know Nuremberg trials ended up in guys getting hanged. So I don’t think it’s going to go that far, but the accountability, I agree, needs to be there. And I mean, for me, that means jail time. I mean, I can’t see any other way of us getting past this. What do you think?

we can do in terms of accountability for those that were complicit and or guilty of committing major fraud against Canadian citizens.

Liam DeBoer (15:24.482)
Yeah, I go towards jail time as well. Another thing that Jonathan and I, fellow that I do Blender News with and host a podcast with, him and I talk about it frequently where you also need to seize these people’s assets. The fact that, and I think it goes to many, many different levels, but let’s use the Liberal Party as an example. So for instance, you’ve got guys like Randy Bosno who is in the…

who was recently booted out of the liberal cabinet, but he’s still, yeah, yeah. So he was recently booted out, yeah. Well, I’ll get into that, because he’s a literal gangster, most likely, allegedly. Is that, so one of the things that he was found, that whole surrounding scandal, it was funny to see the news, especially CBC and stuff, position it as it was,

David Morrow (15:53.83)
Was that the two Randys? What a gangster. What a gangster.

David Morrow (16:05.826)
please do. Yeah.

Liam DeBoer (16:19.906)
So to give everybody oversight of that, roughly a month ago, he was kicked out of Liberal, the caucus. He’s still serving as an MP, by the way. So he’s still collecting a taxpayer funded salary, but he stepped out of Trudeau’s like inside group, more or less. And the reason that the media framed it as is because he was lying about having indigenous heritage. He served in the Liberal Indigenous Caucus.

David Morrow (16:35.909)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (16:45.496)
He would start his some of his speeches out speaking in Cree and all of this. Yeah, yeah. And he even said the Cree community, you my name is Randy Bosno, but the Cree community sometimes refers to me as strong eagle man. And yeah.

David Morrow (16:49.88)
No. Ugh.

David Morrow (17:02.278)
no! Man, you’re making me uncomfortable, man.

Liam DeBoer (17:09.261)
It was extremely cringe. seemed it was something straight out of straight out of a movie. Actually, I think it was one of the scary movies because I clipped it into one of our videos about this topic and the whole the guy standing there going, hey, how are you? Hey, how are you? was like, this is Randy Bosno. I was like, this is what Randy Bosno is doing. so that’s how the media framed it was this is all about a lie of him.

David Morrow (17:11.791)
Ugh.

David Morrow (17:26.182)
Hey,

Liam DeBoer (17:37.986)
with his indigenous heritage. But if you actually look really deep into that story, what was also coming out was that, so he had a company called Global Health Imports, GHI, with a business partner named Steven Anderson. And this is what the whole Two Randys situation was, was that he was using…

Global Health Imports, he was a business owner at the time, but when he came into office, he had to cease doing day-to-day operations. He could still withdraw equity or be part of the financial stake, but he wasn’t able to make decisions within the businesses that would have been a conflict of interest. While what was happening behind the scenes was that Steven Anderson was still using Randy Bosno as a leverage point with clients from Global Health Imports saying like, well,

we got to check with Randy about that, right? Or we have a powerful Randy that can help move these things along for us. So he was using it as like a bargaining piece within his dealings. What also came out from that, so there he’s breaking conflict of interest ethics, but then what also came out was that Global Health Imports was full on doing fraudulent business dealings. they…

there was multiple businesses that came forward and said that GHI during the height of the pandemic. So again, remember this is a sitting MP at the time who is involved in this company conflict of interest was this company was selling PPE equipment. So protective pandemic, protective equipment to companies taking deposits for hundreds of thousands of dollars and then just not delivering any products.

David Morrow (18:56.294)
He said that PHI during the height of the pandemic, so again, I’m just saying that she is in this company for all sorts of interests. This company was selling PPE equipment, so protective, pandemic protective equipment, to companies taking deposits.

Liam DeBoer (19:22.626)
So he was completely, the business was defrauding other businesses of hundreds of thousands of dollars, like major criminal acts here. And then the story gets really crazy when you consider that Steven Anderson was business partners. So Randy Bosno’s business partner was business partners with somebody named Francesca LeBlond.

David Morrow (19:29.606)
Liam DeBoer (19:49.07)
who is an international drug smuggler, had been detained in the Dominican Republic with 460 pounds of cocaine in a private jet. yeah, and then, so, okay, so Randy Bosno is one degree separated from an international drug smuggler. And then it comes out that Randy Bosno, the company that Randy Bosno had, shared a mailing address with Francesca LeBlond. So.

David Morrow (20:07.354)
What?

Liam DeBoer (20:17.652)
his businesses were directly intertwined with this woman as well. So you’ve got seemingly in a liberal MP, and I’m going to wrap this back up. Sorry, this was a long diatribe into Randy Bosno. Yeah. But so you’ve got a sitting liberal caucus member, what would seem to look like being directly involved in organized crime one way or another, or at least criminal acts through defrauding and such.

David Morrow (20:27.406)
Now as you’re doing the weave, I like it. This is really interesting.

Liam DeBoer (20:47.834)
And this guy is still sitting there collecting a taxpayer funded salary to this day. And so in my eyes, I look at that and go, everything that this guy has is due to him abusing his position of power. So this goes to that seizing of assets. Like, why does he get to keep that? I’m sure this guy lives in a nice house. I haven’t seen it, but I’m sure he’s living well.

I don’t think he should be able to keep those possessions anymore. So my proposed suggestion is when you, I think we need a mass investigation into especially the highest levels of government and for those accountability measures. And I think you can do that like a bouquet laid down in El Salvador. He actually pulled in all his high level officials and said, Hey, just to let everyone know.

There’s no bias in how we’re doing this. We’re not attacking our political enemies, but every single person in this government at this level is under investigation for corruption. And I think we need to do that as well. And then, hey, when we seize, if we find out that those assets came from criminal measures, I think they should be seized and they should be sold back to the public in order to pay down the federal deficit that these people have created. like,

David Morrow (21:56.474)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (22:14.711)
I don’t see that as necessarily a bad idea.

David Morrow (22:17.418)
I’m on board. You’re essentially creating the untouchables in a sense. Because you’d have to have an investigative branch that is, I don’t even know if the RCMP, I’m sure there’s RCMP members that could be trusted to do it, but it just seems like there’s so much capture within all government organizations and nobody’s willing to step out of line. The judiciary, the police.

everybody seems to be in on the take until you get vocal enough and you have so much overwhelming evidence that it forces them to actually do something, not because it’s the right thing to do, but because they’re embarrassed. It just seems like we’re living almost like in a banana republic. You did a scathing, scathing video of Trudeau and his Marxist tendencies, which I was just like, shit. So folks, you’re listening right now, go.

pause this video, go look at Liam’s video. Your YouTube channel is Liam DeBoer, is that right? Liam Out Loud, right. I’m gonna put the link here, but go watch that video. Liam, so let’s break it down just kind of step by step because this ties in, right? Because you put it really beautifully. Trudeau has a PR approach. It’s done on purpose. It’s systematic.

Liam DeBoer (23:16.558)
Liam out loud.

David Morrow (23:39.866)
there’s a scandal and then all you need to do is just create another scandal a week or two later and you forget about that last one. And so you just riddle the entire system with scandals. And that’s not a bug, it’s a feature because we’ve had 10 years of nonstop scandals, which in my opinion, any one of these should have completely destroyed his career. But I’m curious to know why you think he’s able to hold on to power and why he’s been able to get away with this insane

ten years as Canadian Prime Minister.

Liam DeBoer (24:13.73)
Well, a couple different, I guess, avenues to go down there. First, I think my opinions have changed slightly on the Trudeau Marxist front. So not that I don’t think a lot of his policies have socialist, collectivist, Marxist ideas within them. It’s that I originally thought that those ideas were coming from within the party.

David Morrow (24:25.414)
okay.

Liam DeBoer (24:39.874)
that the party themselves were coming up with them. I don’t think Trudeau has ever come up with an idea. I mean, I think the PMO was coming up with ideas and Trudeau was just mouth-piecing them. But what I’ve come to really dive deep into over the last about year or so is the Chinese communist infiltration within Canada. And so you can go look at guys like Stephen Goubault, our environment minister, and who is one of the close allies of Trudeau in his most lawyer…

David Morrow (24:58.735)
Hmm.

Liam DeBoer (25:09.674)
loyal soldiers is there’s a a NGO a non-government organization called the OCCIECD and I can’t remember exactly what it stands for but it’s the it’s a Chinese environmental NGO so it’s all about climate change and such and

David Morrow (25:16.582)
a non-government organization called the OCCIBC. I can’t remember exactly what it stands for.

David Morrow (25:34.694)
and deep as you go.

Liam DeBoer (25:35.118)
Stephen Goubault, our environment minister, is sitting as the vice president of that organization. And when I went onto that organization’s website, and anybody can do this, go look at all of the executive members and other people that sit within powerful positions of that organization, and they are all Chinese Communist Party members. I think I counted before I stopped, at a certain point I just stopped. I was like, this is insane.

David Morrow (25:58.096)
you

Liam DeBoer (26:04.888)
But I got to 23. There was 23 CCP members within that organization. And like, we’re talking high level CCP members. And so what I’ve come to realize is that you’ve got people within the liberal government that are sitting within organizations. And I think this happens across energy sectors, climate change, national security, all of it. They’re sitting on boards with other CCP members. And so I looked at it and went,

David Morrow (26:06.714)
Whoa.

Liam DeBoer (26:33.214)
these aren’t Marxist ideas that the Liberal Party is coming up with, it’s that the Liberal Party is intertwined with the Chinese Communist Party, and I think that’s where those ideas are coming from. And so that, so I still think those ideas and those policies are still being implemented, but it’s just where is it originating, has, that’s where my mind has changed on things.

David Morrow (26:56.678)
Okay, so that begs the question. If you study history even just over last few decades, right, Trudeau 1.0, he had a hard-on for China, right? Okay, so why is there such a link there between the Trudeaus and China? Is it an ideological thing? Is there a story there that you know of? I’m curious, I don’t know why there’s such a link there between communists.

Liam DeBoer (27:08.558)
Mm-hmm.

David Morrow (27:23.352)
in Trudeau and you know now I speak with my parents and you know my relatives that are boomers a lot of them think Trudeau is especially here in Montreal because he’s from here. Best thing in the world. Okay Trudeau’s but you speak to other Canadians and they have almost the same like vitriol towards Trudeau 2.0 as to 1.0. So what was going on there? you have any insight as to why there’s an alignment between this family and then the Liberal Party with the CCP? What’s going on there?

Liam DeBoer (27:51.884)
Yeah, so I think this is, you know, I don’t even think this is just necessarily a modern phenomena. I think this is one of the oldest battles in history. Collectivists versus individualists. I think this goes way back. I think actually Jordan Peterson has done a very good job of even explaining how the biblical narrative of Cain and Abel very much applies to today.

And I’m not saying, you know, I’m not a typical Christian or anything of that nature. I’ve never gone to church or whatever. But I think there is great wisdom in the stories. so Peterson has outlined the story of Cain and Abel and continually goes back to it. And the story is, is that you’ve got two brothers and God asks them to make sacrifices to him. And Abel makes

the most noble sacrifice he can. He gives it his all, essentially. Cain gives essentially a half-assed offering to God, and for that, God punishes Cain and rewards Abel. He said, you gave the proper sacrifice, so I’m going to reward you for such. Out of vengeance, out of jealousy and resentment in the story, Cain kills Abel.

to get revenge on his brother. He’s essentially jealous the fact that he has God’s approval. Where I’m going with this is I think that that psychological function of resentment, bitterness, envy, et cetera, of people that don’t make the proper sacrifices in life and therefore don’t get the rewards they want, instead of changing their attitude and starting to give the proper sacrifices, they actually start attacking the people who do this successful.

And so, you know, even when this goes into the Marxist ideology is I believe Marxism and communism, this idea, you know, okay, you’ve got the capitalist class that is exploiting the working class and therefore we need to wage war against the oppressors, the successful, and take what they have and redisperse it to the unsuccessful. I think that is that exact same

David Morrow (29:58.406)
is exploiting the working class and therefore we need to fight for, against the press as successful, that can what they have and bring the purpose to.

Liam DeBoer (30:14.956)
I guess what would you call it? That ethos of the Cain and Abel story. And so I think there is just people, a large portion of people that kind of fall into that basket that are say resentful about where their life is at. And then they want to create a political system and literally transform the world into change the, they go.

David Morrow (30:32.614)
Hmm.

Liam DeBoer (30:42.594)
They start waging war against the ideal that they can’t live up to. So they can’t live up to providing for themselves in a capitalist society. So they want to destroy the capitalist society. And that’s actually, even if you go look at Marx, there’s a great book called The Devil and Karl Marx by Paul Kangor. And it details Marx’s private life. And Marx was a loser. Like he couldn’t…

David Morrow (31:10.993)
Okay.

Liam DeBoer (31:11.182)
provide for his family. He was extremely ugly. He didn’t have anybody’s approval within society. His own dad was like, why are you so bitter? Why are you so resentful? His dad, I mean, at the time this was a very religious epoch. His dad, in a letter that is cited in this book, calls essentially Karl Marx. He says, what demon has taken hold of you?

So this is what the dad is saying to his son. But going back into the Trudeau realm is that I think they’ve just fallen into that idea, which is ironic considering, you know, they have a lot. this Marxist idea. so I think Marx didn’t invent this idea. He just essentially directed it 200 years ago. You can even go look at

David Morrow (31:47.814)
is that I think they’ve just fallen into that idea, is ironic considering they have a lot. But this Marxist idea, and so I think Marx didn’t invent this idea, he just essentially directed it 200 years ago.

Liam DeBoer (32:10.156)
people like Fyodor Dostoevsky, the Russian literate, who is one of the best of all times, I’d say in the top five, obviously, I think a lot of people would put Shakespeare at the top. even he, in like the 1700s, talked about how the socialists in Russia, and this was before Marx, and he detailed this whole idea out, just like Marx kind of did. And just being like, look, this is the sentiment that people have.

And so I don’t think it’s a conspiracy as much as it is just there’s behavior patterns that humans can fall into. And I think the Trudeau family has allowed that ideology, that behavior pattern to instruct them. I mean, you can go look back. There’s a National Post article about the history of China with Trudeau and how Pierre Trudeau brought

their family, his family to China right after the Tiananmen Square incident. And essentially the article lays out how Pierre Trudeau brainwashed his family into thinking that this socialist, like utopia idea is the way forward. China is the way forward. And so when I sit here and I point out the Chinese Communist Party infiltration of the liberal party,

And obviously I think anybody that is logical would look at that and go, wow, this is a mess. What are we doing? We need to do something about this. I don’t think Trudeau is even hiding it. I think he genuinely believes that it’s a good thing. He’s like, no, no, no, no, for the sake of humanity, like China is the way forward. He’s been told to think this way since a kid.

David Morrow (33:56.602)
He said so Yeah, I mean he said This is Liam. This is the best explanation I’ve ever got so this is

Liam DeBoer (34:00.93)
Sorry, that was a very long-winded way,

David Morrow (34:09.19)
For me, for the listeners, maybe they’re like, yeah, Dave, come on. Obviously that was case. But for me, that just hit the nail right on the head. Yeah, it’s the fight, right? There’s nothing new, just technology changes and then context might change a little bit. But whether you want to call it communism, capitalism, these forces, if you want to call them good and evil or left and right, they do come from a psychological place within us all.

Liam DeBoer (34:09.261)
Yeah

David Morrow (34:38.706)
They may get rebranded and Trudeau has said he has an admiration for the basic dictatorship of China. For a leader of a G7 nation to have said that, that should have out of hand just said been the nail in his political career. like, dude, you can’t go and say that communism is great when you’re leading a country that is in the West. Come on, bro, that’s red flags everywhere.

I was talking to a friend of mine who is in the Intel world and stuff like that, and he works in the United States and we’ve been having conversations for years. And he said like back in the day, he’s talking to some old school guys. He’s like, oh yeah, the Americans called Trudeau 1.0 a communist straight up to like his face. And I think there’s documents even to support that. And now it all kind of starts to make sense. But having that ideology implanted when you’re a kid, it’s hard to break those patterns, right? So that makes total sense.

Liam DeBoer (35:35.246)
There’s even a quote in that National Post article that I was talking about about the history of the Trudeau family in China. Andre Trudeau’s brother is quoted in that article saying, now I’m slightly paraphrasing because I don’t remember verbatim, but essentially what he said was over the last 60 years, 70 years, the…

Progress that China has made on the industrialization front was not possible without the organization that the Chinese Communist Party made happen. So he essentially put all of the industrial progress, everything good that ever happened with China over the last few decades into the basket of this is because the Chinese Communist Party organized and controlled everything.

And then right next to that, he pretty much says, I can’t remember the exact language, but he gave the old trope of you can’t make an omelet without breaking a few eggs. And that was in reference to the fact that the Chinese Communist Party killed any estimates range anywhere from 40 to 60 million people over in over their rain. Well, I mean, they’re still raining today. It’s a lot of eggs. And and so you can just kind of see that where like

David Morrow (36:51.046)
It’s a lot of eggs. It’s a lot of eggs.

Liam DeBoer (36:58.72)
Okay, that is in the Trudeau family mind. The fact that, well, where China is today, the end justified the means, which was a trail of 40 to 60 million dead people. that’s a very, very dangerous, you wanna talk about evil, like the battle of good and evil, that’s kind of where I was going with tying in the whole biblical narrative earlier and such, is that, I don’t really see this as,

China versus Canada or say a political realm of democracy versus communism. I think it’s something much deeper, is on a spiritual front of a good and evil. But yeah, if your idea is that, well, if we centralize power, if we give ourselves all this power, we can do, we’re so noble and we have the highest intentions that it’ll be good for it. And even if…

David Morrow (37:55.325)
It’ll be good for it even if you kill millions upon millions of people by using that.

Liam DeBoer (37:58.092)
we kill millions upon millions of people by using that power. Well, again, our intentions are so noble that that is all just a couple of broken eggs.

David Morrow (38:09.286)
Yeah, I mean I this idea that this is a crisis of the soul is Really what I came to realize not that long ago we can fight about the the

the words that we’re using, we can fight about the means, we can fight about all the technical aspects of, that’s against the law and that broke my human right, but at a fundamental level, and I think this is where, once you start to think and you start to think critically, and things are misaligned with what your fundamental beliefs are and what your principles are, and communist values, Marxist values, are very much not in alignment with my values.

Right. And obviously they’re not in alignment with your values. And so that creates like a crisis of conscience, crisis of the soul. And once I started to frame it, was thanks to again, Jordan Peterson that started framing things differently for me. I started to get a grip of my mental health because it was really, it was really bothersome. I really had a hard time coming to grips with the fact that I knew that my public health officials here in Canada were lying to me and everybody.

because I knew that immunity was given once you have a virus and you fight it off. I was like, yeah. But then once they start lying, well, I know governments lie, but that’s a bold face lie. Why would you go ahead and just do that? And so one by one, that started making me realize, there’s something bigger going on here. This isn’t just about fighting a virus. There is something that is trying to grip the soul.

of our country and I don’t think if it weren’t for folks like yourself and know, people getting loud on the internet and because we had no other means, I don’t know what would have happened and that’s where you know, you’re very well read, you know you’re 1984 really well, you know you’re Aldous Huxley really well and I’d like to take a quick commercial break to have our sponsor say a few words and then come right back with talking about 1984 and what your take is.

David Morrow (40:27.298)
on it with respect to how we’re going down a certain path.

David Morrow (40:33.67)
All right, so you good? Start back up. You need a break? Yeah, take a break. Awesome, awesome. I’m gonna get some water.

Liam DeBoer (40:37.42)
Yeah, you know what, actually just, I am gonna hit the bathroom real quick, but I’ll be right back.

David Morrow (41:33.764)
watered up. I still got that Superman curl going on. You know what? I’m in my 40s and I’m just like, man, I still got full head of hair and I’ve yet to get any gray. like, I’m going to grow. I’m going to grow this thing, man. I’m going to get a mane. So that’s

Liam DeBoer (41:39.01)
Hahaha

Liam DeBoer (41:46.232)
Take it.

Liam DeBoer (41:51.198)
I’m starting to get grazed like crazy. Probably all this.

David Morrow (41:54.342)
But you’re a young buck, you’re in your 30s, no?

Liam DeBoer (41:57.304)
Just turn 30, yeah.

David Morrow (41:58.438)
Oh, just turned 30. Wow. Oh, Man. Yeah, I can’t even remember 30. That’s how long ago it was, man. That was a long time ago. Yeah, enjoy it, man. It’s good. It’s good that you’re in this game, man. We need a little more young bucks taking up the charge, man. That’s really cool. So, okay, let’s get right back into it. We’re going to talk about 1984. Sound good? All right. Three, two, All right, folks, we’re back. And Liam, let’s get into 1984. Now,

Liam DeBoer (42:00.716)
Just turned 30, yeah, about a month ago.

Liam DeBoer (42:06.167)
the

Liam DeBoer (42:21.752)
Sounds good.

David Morrow (42:28.422)
Admittedly, I have not read A Brave New World. I have not read Huxley. I just saw the movie with Sandra Bullock in that one. Or am I missing that? I think I’m mixing that up with Demolition Man. Either way, big fan of 1984. the video, like the movie, still, like I play that on loop sometimes in my head. I read the book a bunch of times, but the movie had a big impact on me. Because it was so, it almost felt macabre. Like it was just.

unbelievable to the extent when I saw it, I was in my 20s, was like, man, imagine that happened. I’m in my 40s and I’m hearing my relatives say, you know, these people that aren’t getting the vaccines, they should be put in camps. We’ve got to do something about them. I’ve got my prime minister saying that I’m a racist misogynist and I’m a fringe minority member. And I’m just going, oh.

Liam DeBoer (43:24.098)
Don’t forget he asked whether we should tolerate these people. Again, that’s a very, that’s the exact same idea that leads to, those people should be in camps. Do we want these people to be part of society?

David Morrow (43:27.578)
I know it’s just like…

David Morrow (43:31.526)
Camps.

It got so bad, especially here in Quebec. Quebec has a weird, and being a minority in my own province, it’s weird seeing how the French mind works compared to the English mind. Now don’t get me wrong, there was a lot of Anglephones across the country that were just like, yeah, load them up in camps, let’s go. But the…

the French seemed to have a very strong authoritarian streak still in them. And they were just like, yeah, let’s get them in the cars. Let’s bring them to the camps. Like was in the newspapers, not even hiding it. And then my like 1984 brain was like, holy shit, this is happening. And then the TV was just repeating the same thing over and over and over again, safe and effective, safe and effective.

and I got super freaked out and I didn’t know what was going to happen and it caused a lot of stress. I wrote a book to help myself deal with the stress, which is not about COVID, but it just helped me deal with it. But from your perspective, how was Orwell’s work almost like a premonition to what is to come and like, are we through it yet? And where do you think this is all going?

Liam DeBoer (44:32.727)
nice.

Liam DeBoer (44:49.976)
Well, I don’t even think it’s necessarily that Orwell’s work is a premonition of a future as much as it is. And I mean, he might’ve even said that, you know, one of his famous quotes as well is that if you want to imagine the future, just picture a boot stomping on a human face forever. But I think what he did was detail something much deeper, which is just the mechanisms of totalitarianism.

David Morrow (45:03.974)
Brutal.

Liam DeBoer (45:15.072)
And I first want to a distinct like distinguish between totalitarianism and dictatorships because you this isn’t something you know even up until about six months a year ago that I wouldn’t have been able to understand the difference but the crucial part about totalitarianism is that the people don’t know they’re being tyrannized. And to take it a step further the people actively engage in their own subjugation.

So for instance, that’s why I COVID was entirely actually totalitarian. It wasn’t even just a dictatorship because a dictator is somebody’s will asserting it unwantedly over a population. Whereas within COVID, like you even look at say the vaccine mandates and stuff within restaurants or flying all of this, like we enforced it on ourselves. There wasn’t a military member standing at the front door of restaurants checking people’s vaccination.

We did it to ourselves. It was our compliance that made it happen. And so I think what Orwell told throughout 1984 was how a society becomes totalitarian. And I also think it goes, know, he used the Soviet Union as a foundation for that novel. Even the regime in 1984 is called Ingsoc, which is Newspeak, you know, one of

Norwellian concept for English socialism. Ingsoc, that’s what that means. But I think it applies to also fascist nations, whatever Hitler and Mussolini did. And then also as well, there’s a great book called The New Inquisitions by Arthur Versluis. And what he distinguished was how

What we’re seeing with the woke movement is exactly the same thing as the fascists. It’s exactly the same thing as the communists. And he actually even traced it back. said the first aspect of what we’re seeing, this phenomenon of totalitarianism was actually the Spanish inquisitions, the Christian inquisitions. And so this is what Orwell gets to. And so this is why I don’t think it’s necessarily a premonition as much as it is a explanation of human nature at its worst.

Liam DeBoer (47:35.406)
which is that when things go totalitarian, the real goal, just like in the Inquisitions or 1984, is to get to the bottom of the human psyche, is to literally control thought itself, to control perspective. And that’s actually even in the…

the climax of 1984 when Winston is getting tortured by O’Brien in the room 101, think it was. O’Brien is showing him, he goes, how many fingers am I holding up? And Winston’s like, four. And he’s like, no, it’s five. And he goes, no, it’s four. by the end, then O’Brien goes on his monologue and he goes, no, you have to understand we’re the party, we are power.

David Morrow (48:05.414)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (48:23.074)
Reality is whatever we say it is. I don’t even care if you see four fingers if I say it’s five it is five and that is totalitarianism is just the population accepting the lie Knowing that they’re being lied to knowing that they’re not seeing four fingers But just being so afraid of power that they that they go. Yeah, it’s five and then they also start gaslighting everybody else into being like no that see they are holding up five fingers

David Morrow (48:46.575)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (48:50.08)
And it’s just that is totalitarianism. So I think that’s what Orwell was pointing out in 1984 was this exact phenomenon from the Inquisitions, communism, fascism, wokeism. It’s all the same thing.

David Morrow (49:03.282)
man. And then the other 1980, with the rat eating your face, that was another, an image, I can’t get it out of my head, but you nailed it, yeah. Yeah, four, but no, it’s five. It’s like, no, no, I see it. I’m perceiving it, it’s four. No, it’s not, and that is exactly the best definition of what happened during this whole, I know, it’s starting to all unravel. know, Zuckerberg was just on Rogan saying like, yeah, we shouldn’t have done that. We shouldn’t have had any of those.

Liam DeBoer (49:09.144)
Yeah.

David Morrow (49:32.538)
fact checkers, I was pressured by the government. So, you know, I gotta give him that. He’s having his, like, come to Jesus moment, maybe even literally, I don’t know. Maybe he’s converting, I don’t know. But, needless to say, there’s a change happening. because of that change, I’m optimistic. Because I was worried for a minute there that we’re not coming back. We’re cooked. And anybody that is going to…

have any kind of dissenting voice because we’re still living with the bills that were implemented. I think C11, is there C36 that’s coming down the pipe? Like these are terrible bills that will just crush free speech. as podcasters, this is who they’re targeting because I think they fundamentally know we’re like the last bastion. You know, the actual media, you know, the mainstream media.

They fell in line. No problem. We pay them, they’re ours. The only people that are left are guys like yourself, just spitting the truth. But that had to get crushed. I know for a fact, I was surveilled. That’s insane. And in the veteran population, even more so, the worry is that we’re radicalized. And that to me is the sign that now we’ve lost the plot. I fought my entire career against radicals. We were the ones fighting against terrorism.

We were the ones that were hired and willingly went into the fight to fight our nation’s enemies. And now you have the audacity to call us the enemies. And so that really left a black stain. And yeah, yeah.

Liam DeBoer (51:11.906)
Can I just, can I just hear, here’s the depth of you. Let me tell you a quick story about that when it comes to, you know, we’re now the radicals. So in the Soviet Union, just so people can grab, and I’m not saying we’re here, but I think people need to understand the levels of evil that we can get to if we allow the government to control the narrative and also remain like just operate unchecked. So the Soviet Union in world war two.

David Morrow (51:38.47)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (51:41.674)
Obviously, they had complete control over the information sphere. Censorship like crazy, every news story came from Pravda, which was Russian for truth, which was just the propaganda outlet. So Russia was controlling reality within the minds of Russians. And during World War II, when those Russians started going across Europe in order to descend on Germany,

David Morrow (51:51.302)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (52:10.326)
they started realizing that the reality of the world was not at all what they were told. know, the Soviet Union would say, we’re the only nation in the world that has a subway system like this or whatever. And then they’d get to Europe and be like, wait, they have subways. And, or even little things actually, even recently we saw North Korea, another communist nation, right? They just got sent to the front lines in Russia to fight for Russia. And they’re having an issue with all of their troops gorging on porn.

They won’t fight properly anymore because they’re just like, what is this? What is this? We’re just figuring out about this. And they just can’t get them to stop watching porn all day. But which is kind of hilarious, but also sad at the same time. so what did the Soviet Union do with their soldiers once their soldiers were like, wait, our everything is a lie. When they came back to the Soviet Union after that, the regime started throwing

David Morrow (52:40.449)
No. No!

David Morrow (52:50.662)
It’s awful. It’s funny.

Liam DeBoer (53:09.058)
the military veterans into concentration camps because they didn’t want them to spread the word to other people within the society that this is what’s really happening. No, your government is wrong. Your government is evil. So they just locked them up. Like, can you imagine the level of evil that is to be like, okay, I want to recruit or I’m going to enforce you to fight for your nation. I’m going to call you a hero. You’re doing heroic work fighting for your nation.

And then when you get back, I’m going to lock you up so that other people can’t tell. You just risked your life for me. I forced you to put your life on the line. And now I’m going to throw you in a concentration camp to make sure that you can’t tell the people who are lying to them. So this idea that governments at all or powerful entities would care about their foot soldiers, just to go back to what you were saying there, as soon as…

you don’t serve their purpose anymore. Yeah, you’re the radical, you’re the extremist, you’re the problem we need to deal with.

David Morrow (54:09.446)
Hmm, that makes a lot. Oh, Solso Knitsen literally wrote about that. was an he was a artillery officer, right? And he was thrown into the gulags and into the archipelago, right? That book is it. That book is insanely hard. I listened to it. I don’t I don’t read it. But it’s so hard to listen to because it’s is it Kafka ask what how do you even describe what he’s describing? Because I’ve never experienced it. It just seems

Liam DeBoer (54:13.592)
Right.

Liam DeBoer (54:17.091)
Right.

David Morrow (54:39.47)
It’s like this loop of insanity and you can’t break out of it. And it just goes on.

Liam DeBoer (54:44.462)
It’s hours on end of a man screaming into the void saying there are millions upon millions of people literally living in hell and like just somebody listen. That’s what that book is, yeah.

David Morrow (54:55.866)
Yeah, it’s so soul crushing that this literally happened. This can happen. And it is happening right now. Places like North Korea, it’s happening. We’re able to descend into there, but it just seems like we refuse to kind of accept that if we let things go off the rails, even by a fraction of a degree over the span of 20, 30, 40, 50 years, that’s how you end up with.

the seriousness of a totalitarian regime and we see it and those that study history and the irony is we read all these books in elementary, no, no, in high school here, know, C.Jep, you know, maybe even university. And, you know, a lot of my teachers, you know, we preach freedom and autonomy and, you know, you’re in charge of yourself because of very pro-Western values. But as soon as this hit, like all the teachers, all the, they dropped all of that and they got right in line.

And even the military, that’s my next point, even the military here in Canada, they got right in line. You were mentioning woke culture and woke ideology. It’s completely captured our entire military. And I realized when I joined in 2001, it was starting, but I didn’t quite catch on. I was a kid, right? I was 19 years old. And they were bringing in equitable stuff that I thought was great because, hey, yeah, I didn’t understand the difference between equity and…

and equality, I had no idea, because I was a 19 year old dumb dumb. But as I got older, I realized, I had a resentment. I had a resentment to soldiers, especially female ones, that didn’t have to pass the same standard. Why? Why is that the case? We have the same bullets, we have the same enemy, we have no difference on the battlefield. And that kind of rubbed me the wrong way, but I just shut up about it, because I was like, whatever, it’s not my fight. And then we get 20 years down the road.

And we start seeing now with a thing like COVID, anybody that stepped out of line, basically, if you didn’t have purple hair, if you didn’t agree with the government, you were now a pariah and you had to get kicked out of the forces. And I think the amount of damage this did, because we didn’t see the long-term effect of doing this to the armed forces, is just crushed the mental health of not only the serving members, but those that did serve, like myself and my friends, because…

David Morrow (57:15.558)
We now realize the organization that we believed in, that we served for, and that we gave our bodies to and our souls to was completely morally bankrupt. you know, talking about woke culture and stuff like that, from your perspective, you talked about in some of your videos the capture of this ideology. From your perspective, have you seen, from the military side of things, do you have an idea of why they would go after the military?

in terms of capturing it ideologically, almost like a first shot across the bow.

Liam DeBoer (57:51.276)
Yeah, so I think there’s a select few institutions within society that are high priority targets for revolutionaries, really. So let’s say you are of this Marxist socialist, well, ideology, whatever. And actually we’ve got an article on our sub stack that breaks down the 100 year history of that idea if anyone is interested going from here’s how the communists literally branded

throughout the entire thing, like short, long story short, in the 1960s or so, the Marxists of the Western world realized that an economic argument wasn’t going to work in the West for communism, because if you look at where communism did take a hold in the Eastern world, so Russia, China, Korea and such, was they went straight from feudalism into communism.

So people never had rights. They never had freedom. They never had economic prosperity. But it was pretty hard to radicalize the Western factory worker who’s like, what do you mean? I work 45, 50 hours a week and I’ve got a family of four, a house over our heads. Like you’re going to tell me that I need to fight this system. Like, I don’t know. It’s working for me. And so they couldn’t.

David Morrow (58:50.15)
you

David Morrow (59:11.686)
system is great.

Liam DeBoer (59:13.494)
Right. And so they couldn’t radicalize the working class of the West. And the intellectuals realized this. And so they went, wait, so how do we get this? Which is funny because it’s kind of an admittance that their idea is wrong. But they went, OK, well, how do we radicalize the people then? And what they realized was we’ve got to start a culture war. And so it was the way to attack the West is through their culture. There was a guy named Antonio Gramsci.

who is one of the foundational Marxist thinkers, and he was actually in Italy during this period. But what he said was, we have to do a long march through the institutions. So if we want to bring communism to the West, don’t forget about the factory workers. We’re not gonna go get factory workers to rise up against their capitalist owner or whatever, We need to get into education. We need to get into military.

We need to get into these very important institutions within a society. And we just need to get into administrative positions within those institutions. And that’s how we’re going to transform this society. So literally like 60, 70, 80 years ago, you can see the blueprint for what we’re seeing today being laid.

And it’s been a decades long approach by these revolutionaries. And it’s been like a passing of the torch. It’s not one person leading the charge. It’s they’re all like people in this ideology are just finding new ways to fight for it. And so that’s exactly why you’re seeing the military do that. And so where I was going with this was that there’s a select few institutions that are extremely important. One is governance. So like you need

the MPs and such, we need to infiltrate that sphere. And then education and also military. Those are like three of the most important aspects to corrupt if you want to take over a society. And, you know, I mean, we can see it in our education as well. And so you look at these very important institutions, you go look at all their documents and it’s like, yeah, all the administrators are pushing this stuff. So that was the whole idea was like, we need to get into positions of

Liam DeBoer (01:01:33.728)
authority within these institutions and then we need to push this agenda. And so for the last 40, 50 years they’ve been trying to get into those positions and now we’re just seeing what happens when people with that ideology are in those positions.

David Morrow (01:01:48.134)
Okay, okay, so this makes a lot of sense in context of when I was in university, I was in the education department. I was one of the few heterosexual men that was there because I wasn’t in the phys ed department. Like I was always assuming, you’re in phys ed. I’m like, no, no, I’m in regular teaching. They’re like, okay. But I could tell right away, I had straight up professors say like, I don’t like you. I’m like, but I don’t dislike you. What’s going on here? Like why are you upset with me?

You have sent me, but it’s because I represented something that was very antithetical to what they wanted to do because I represented the traditional male values, but I wasn’t tracking. So now it makes sense that if somebody like myself were to be in their organization, I represent the pushback that they don’t want. That makes a lot of sense because education was essentially captured by communists. It’s a communist infiltration, but…

It seems like there’s a pushback now, but you mentioned something.

Liam DeBoer (01:02:49.326)
Actually, I just want to add one point so that it doesn’t sound so conspiratorial. So the most widely cited intellectual in all of academia is a guy named Michel Foucault, who is a French philosopher from the 1960s. He is the most cited intellectual in all of academia. He was one of the foundational thinkers who, and this is what he said, he was like, Marx was right, but he just

David Morrow (01:02:53.722)
Okay, yeah.

David Morrow (01:03:04.6)
Yeah!

Liam DeBoer (01:03:19.244)
was right within a foundation that Marx thought power existed between the bourgeoisie and the proletariat, the capitalist versus the worker. But, and he was right about that, but what Michel Foucault did then is when, but he didn’t take it far enough. It’s actually that power exists across every domain, not just economic. And so this is where you see this concept of, and this wasn’t his concept, but another person has picked it up since then,

intersectionality, which is that, okay, power isn’t just between bourgeoisie and proletariat. Power is, again, broken culturally. So now it’s that power is dispersed between man versus woman, gay versus straight, black versus white, rural versus urban. So you have all of these in there’s actually anybody can go Google intersectionality and there’s literally like a matrix.

David Morrow (01:04:09.702)
and

Liam DeBoer (01:04:16.492)
that shows where the power center lies. so they’ve just, instead of it being your economic situation determines your social standing. It’s your identity, all of these different markers determines your economic situation, which then determines your standing. So they’ve just built on the original idea. But so to your point, it’s not, this is why there was a target on year back in those schools is because

Again, now bourgeoisie doesn’t, or the ruling class now means cisgendered, straight, heterosexual, white, able-bodied male. Like, that’s the bourgeoisie now. And so it sounds insane, but like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

David Morrow (01:04:43.878)
Now third quasi doesn’t toward the ruling class, now means misgendered, straight, heterosexual, white, stable-bodied males.

Us, We’re the problem. man, that is such a great way, I haven’t had it put that way. So okay, this makes a lot of sense. In the military, what they’ve done is exactly what you’re talking about. They have like indigenous remembrance day, they have like black remembrance day, they have like LGBTQZW whatever, and I’m like wait no, there’s one remembrance day. What are we talking about here? And then on top of that, they have

the different flags and I’m like, hold on a sec, we’re one fighting force since I started. It’s one mission, one fighting force. You can’t break that. But now it makes, if you do, if you break that, then you break the entire soul of the military. So here’s my last question. I wanna see if we can close this loop. We mentioned before we went online, something about mental health here in the West with our soldiers and mental health with soldiers. And I believe you mentioned the IDF.

Is there a link there between this type of ideology and the mental health of our soldiers and our veterans?

Liam DeBoer (01:06:03.244)
Yeah, for sure. So I think, first of all, this ideology is a very bitter, resentful, it essentially gives you license to think that way and tells you that, yes, you’re actually good if you’re bitter and resentful because the world is oppressive, right? So I think the people that naturally pick up and implement this ideology, I think they’re already mentally unwell. And I don’t just mean that in a derogatory way, but I actually think, actually…

anybody can go look at this. People that are more likely to believe these ideas are vastly overrepresented when it comes to things like crazy anxiety disorders and depression and such. But when it comes to the mental health within the military, what I was mentioned in Tia beforehand that is really interesting here is that, so you look at something like the IDF and no matter what your opinion is on Israel or any of these situations,

David Morrow (01:06:40.101)
Hmm.

Liam DeBoer (01:07:00.396)
The mentality within those soldiers is that they are surrounded by hostile nations, which is a reality. And so for them, the fight is super important. It’s on our front doorstep, right? Like if we don’t fight today, tomorrow we’re dead. Whereas in the Western world, we’re miles, like thousands of miles away from the battlefield. So there’s no direct essentially feeling like this is for self-defense.

And I think subconsciously a lot of veterans are picking up on that, being like, wait, if I didn’t go fight in Afghanistan, would we really be that much unsafer in Canada? Maybe you can make arguments for it for sure. But I think there’s a little bit about that. then there’s, and I’m grabbing this perspective from Sebastian Younger’s book, Tribe, which is really interesting. And so what he pointed out was that,

David Morrow (01:07:39.728)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (01:07:54.432)
An added aspect of that is, okay, I go across the world to fight a war. So it doesn’t feel like it’s on my front doorstep. It doesn’t feel like it’s highly necessary. I go fight that war. And then when I come back, my country is at war with itself. It’s pulling itself apart. Nobody’s like, so what am I even fighting for? And then also on top of that, to the woke aspect,

Okay, now I go over and I fight for the country and I come back and all my institutions are telling me that I’m evil, that I’m a problem. What the hell am I fighting for at this point? And then what ends up happening is your mind starts going, wait, all of those, you know, we were talking about it earlier where people, if they believe when it comes to say the communists, well, our goal is so noble that therefore the means are…

justified. Now, look at this in this perspective as you go. I can understand and I actually think there is moral scenarios where taking a life is the right thing to do. If somebody breaks into your home tonight and is threatening to kill your family, like I don’t think your psyche is going to have any issue dealing with that problem and afterwards you’ll sit there and go

David Morrow (01:08:50.266)
Mm-hmm.

Liam DeBoer (01:09:16.13)
Look, it was terrible. That was not a situation I ever want to be in again, but I don’t regret taking that person’s life to save my family. But put the exact same scenario in there where you take somebody’s life and you don’t have a moral justification for it. Well, now you’ve just done a terrible act. I think, you you would know better about this than I, so I’m not trying to make like a hard statement here, but let’s assume, okay,

Take the Iraq war, for instance. You have a veteran that goes over, fights in the Iraq war, believes he’s fighting for freedom to uphold democracy and protect his family. And then he has to do terrible things throughout that war, take people’s lives. You hear soldiers talk about how like, you know, I had to kill a 12 year old child because somebody had armed him with a suicide vest or of this nature. And then they get back.

David Morrow (01:10:14.374)
Mm-hmm

Liam DeBoer (01:10:15.552)
And what they end up realizing is, the whole pretext, and I’m not putting that, moral culpability on them, but the whole moral pretext for this war was that we were doing what was necessary and these things were necessary to, for freedom and for democracy. But then now I’ve learned that, it was really just because Dick Cheney was getting rich with all his Halliburton friends and the Iraq war never.

really needed to happen. In fact, Iraq in that region is in a worse place now than it was before we entered. And then now your mind has to go, well, what did I kill that 12 year old child for? There’s no, there’s no, there’s no justice. I have no justification for that act anymore. Of course, that’s going to leave you with some trauma. And now I’m not, I’m not casting shade upon somebody that, that, you know, was under that, that.

David Morrow (01:10:54.694)
All

Liam DeBoer (01:11:11.276)
that pretext going into the war and maybe did what they thought was necessary. But like I can, I don’t think I would survive that mental struggle of going, shit, like this was not, this was not at all what I thought it was for.

David Morrow (01:11:25.656)
Mm-hmm. Well, you know what? I think this brings it all back to accountability the wars COVID and I think the the start of all this like the decay the rot of our institutions I don’t have enough historical context, but when I kind of came online was September 11th, I just joined the army Buildings came down. shit. I think I might have to go to war. I’m 19 years old I went 10 years later, but still the mindset was there

Something big is happening. And then the unfolding of the trust, because we start realizing, wait, hold on a sec. Maybe we didn’t have to do all these things. Maybe we didn’t have to nation build. Maybe we didn’t have to go into Iraq, like you just said. And then that, like, enter stage right, now there’s this big pandemic going on. I had a distrust to a certain extent because I realized, maybe we should have been in the war. But the final nail in that coffin was the COVID pandemic. And

For me, at least, I was able to find some solace, some comfort in the community, in writing, in doing podcasts, and just getting what was in my head out into the public. But I know a lot of individuals that they don’t have that medium, and they struggle, and for exactly what you’re talking about here, and the ideology that gets supplanted into things like the military, and into the veteran culture, and into just general Canadian culture and American culture is not doing us any

any favors either. And that’s why talking to guys like you is so important, man, because you’ve got a grasp of like the history and you’re able to present it in a really easily digestible form. And I hope folks start following your channel a lot more closely and start bumping those views up. Now that the COVID era is kind of washed out and I think the censorship is ours are starting to get kicked out. We need to get more people listening to what you’re talking about because it’s bang on in my opinion. So Liam, as we wrap up here,

Final thoughts and where can folks find you on social media?

Liam DeBoer (01:13:30.894)
Final thoughts, hey, just to your community of listeners and such, know it’s, yeah, it’s in the military world. So, you know, thank you for everybody that’s done everything. You know, people…

I don’t think what I do is very courageous. think it’s just talking a lot of shit online, but real courage is what a lot of you guys have done. So thank you to all of the people who have done that. And I guess, yeah, just.

It pains me to know that some people are in that mental scenario that I just kind of described there where they go do things that are terrible, but that, and again, sometimes terrible things can be morally justified, but a lot of those instances aren’t.

and I feel terrible for the folks that were lied to and have had their mental world crumbled just simply for power and profit. That’s extremely disturbing to me. So yeah, thank you for all the sacrifices that that community has made and deeply apologize on behalf of our ruling class for what they’ve put you guys through.

David Morrow (01:14:46.256)
Mm-hmm.

David Morrow (01:15:03.654)
All right on. Yeah, and like just to touch base, you know, just on that accountability side, I was talking with Lieutenant Colonel Stu Scheller. So he was the Marine Corps, well, he’s a commanding officer, Lieutenant Colonel in uniform when Kabul fell. And he criticized the general staff and was very vocal about it and got court-martialed for it. But on our conversation, he said,

I can only imagine how much impact it would have if our general staff, if our generals came out and said, hey, this isn’t on you, this is on us, we screwed up. He’s like, that alone, that level of accountability, no jail time, nothing, would mean the world to a lot of us, because it would allow us to let go of that feeling of this is my fault, I did this, I committed those acts. And it would put the blame and shift it towards those individuals who are actually responsible and in leadership positions.

I haven’t seen that yet from Canada, from the US. I’m hoping that I live to see a time when that actually happens. But I think guys like yourself that are pushing that narrative to get more accountability into our system, eventually, eventually, I’m an optimist, it’s going to happen one way or another. And I really appreciate you, man. You’re really doing a lot of good work. to say that you’re not being courageous, I would completely disagree with you on that,

It takes a lot more courage to put yourself out there with your ideas than a grunt like myself carrying a weapon that’s been trained for 10 years to put your head down and go for a walk in the desert. Like it’s totally different. And so I commend you on that. You’re definitely a courageous student. I appreciate what you do. So and lastly, where do they find you on Instagram and social media?

Liam DeBoer (01:16:48.972)
Yeah, so you can find me personally on Instagram at Liam.out.loud. However, Blender News is the organization that I put most of my focus into now. So on Instagram, it is at blender.report. It was a clean at Blender News before Trudeau’s Bill C-11 took us off of Instagram. But then on…

Instagram, or sorry, on Twitter or X, we’re at Blender News. And we also have a newsletter that goes out five days a week, Monday to Friday. Just kind of, we purvey the Globe and Mail, CBC, National Post, blah, blah, down the line and just kind of pick the five to 10 stories that seem highly relevant and condense them down into a single newsletter that can be read in 10 minutes.

And so if you want to sign up for that, can find us on sub stack at Blender News and it’s B L E N D R News. So just no, no E in the final E in the blender. But yeah, hopefully, hopefully people enjoy the work and yeah, it was great chatting with you brother.

David Morrow (01:18:02.192)
Same here, man, same here. Really appreciate it. hey, if everyone do a four by four by 48, let me know. I’m there. Sounds good. All right, buddy. Thanks so much for your time. Really appreciate your insights, man. Keep on doing what you’re doing. And folks, don’t forget, train hard, fight easy. We’ll see you in the next one. Peace.

Liam DeBoer (01:18:08.856)
I’m down. Let’s do it.